NASA has nothing to say about Andrea Rossi’s claim that he has a relationship with NASA. Rossi is an Italian promoter who says he can produce commercially practical levels of LENR-based heat.
A source, who asked to remain anonymous, told New Energy Times that, on Sept. 5 and 6, a team comprising representatives from an investment group and NASA visited Rossi’s showroom in Bologna, Italy. The team went there with an explicit agreement about test parameters and opportunities to observe and evaluate Rossi’s claims. The team members did not observe any positive results.
The Sept. 5 test was inconclusive because Rossi’s device sprang a plumbing leak. The Sept. 6 test was inconclusive because there was no outflow of steam or water.
However, when reporter Mats Lewan from Ny Teknik showed up the next day, Rossi’s device produced an outflow of steam and water. But by then, the NASA observers had gone.
On Sept. 14, Lewan wrote that he observed Rossi’s “one megawatt [power] plant” and that the plant “is now being shipped to the United States.” The same day, Lewan wrote that he observed Rossi’s device producing excess heat without external energy input. Lewan produced and published a scientific-appearing technical report on behalf of Rossi.
The tests on Sept. 5, 6 and 7 were Rossi’s eighth, ninth and 10th attempts to show proof of his concept.
On Sept. 15, New Energy Times asked Dennis Bushnell, chief scientist at NASA’s Langley Research Center in Hampton, Virginia, whether he attended the Sept. 5 and 6 Rossi tests.
“We can’t discuss anything about that,” Bushnell said.
On Sept. 23, New Energy Times asked Jim Dunn, the former director of the NASA Northeast Regional Technology Transfer Center, whether he attended the Sept. 5 and 6 Rossi tests.
“You know I can’t answer that,” Dunn wrote. “All I can say is that I was ‘out of the country.’ The rest is up to your imagination.”
On Sept. 28, New Energy Times published a blog article saying that NASA engineers did not observe any positive results when they went to see Rossi’s device.
On Sept. 29, Rossi responded on his blog:
WARNING: THE SNAKE HAS WRITTEN IN HIS BLOG THAT NASA MADE A NOT POSITIVE TEST WITH US. THIS IS TOTALLY FALSE. I AM BOUND FROM A CONFIDENTIALITY AGREEMENT AND I CANNOT GIVE DETAILED INFORMATION, BUT I CAN SAY THAT:
1- WE ARE IN CONTACT WITH NASA, WHO WANTS TO TEST OUR ECATS TO TEST THE POSSIBILITY TO MAKE THEM USEFUL FOR THEIR PURPOSES
2- NASA’S DENNIS.M.BUSHNELL HAS SAID PUBILCLY THAT NASA WILL BUY AN E-CAT AS SOON AS IT WILL BE POSSIBLE TO TEST IT
3- OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH NASA IS TOTALLY POSITIVE
On Sept. 29, New Energy Times sent a query to Robert Jacobs, NASA deputy associate administrator for communication.
We showed him Rossi’s comments and asked him these questions:
1. Did NASA personnel observe any positive results in September?
2. Do any NASA personnel have, at this time, any interest to participate in or observe additional tests of Andrea Rossi’s “Energy Catalyzer” device?
3. Does any NASA employee have any intention to buy one of Rossi’s devices under any circumstances at this time?
Jacobs replied on Sept. 29.
“I’m not personally aware of such activity, but I will check with Langley, which is where Dennis Bushnell is located, and I will have someone there contact you,” Jacobs wrote.
New Energy Times then sent the questions to Robert D. Wyman, NASA Langley news chief, on Sept. 29.
New Energy Times spoke with Wyman on Oct 4.
“Dennis Bushnell is out of the office this week, and I don’t have any further information,” Wyman said.
In other related news, Rossi is going to attempt today, for the 11th time, evidence for his claim.
This is not, however, Rossi’s promised and long-anticipated October public demonstration and delivery of a 1 megawatt power plant. The test today will be performed only on one of 52 units composing the promised 1 megawatt power plant.
On Sept. 14, Lewan published photos and video of an impressive-looking shipping container that housed 51 individual boxes, each containing a 30-litre tank, with interconnected plumbing and electrical parts sticking out of each one. The 52nd unit was on the bench for testing.
Rossi has failed to demonstrate excess heat in a single device 10 times in a row.
A recognized technology expert who saw the 1 megawatt shipping container in September told New Energy Times that he wasn’t able to overlook the obvious.
“You can’t deliver one megawatt of steam through a 2½-inch pipe unless you go hypersonic,” the expert said.
So observers of the big 1 megawatt demonstration that Rossi promised for October should look for steam exiting the shipping container in excess of 768 mph.
Internet rumors that the Rossi test would be performed using University of Bologna facilities are incorrect, according to an e-mail New Energy Times received yesterday from Paolo Capiluppi, the head of the Physics Department, in response to our questions.
“The contract is not yet active,” Capiluppi wrote. “The university is not involved with the demo by Rossi tomorrow and is not providing any university facility or laboratory.”
Other Internet rumors suggested that Rossi had granted Lewan an exclusive on the story. But Lewan told New Energy Times that is also incorrect.
“I haven’t been offered any exclusive,” he said.
As of 11 p.m. Stockholm time on Wednesday, Lewan would not say whether he would attend.
The E-Cat story has 26 days left to play out.
Convoluted frauds involving lots of parties is the least likely. So are 3 groups of science observers too stupid to recognize an obvious fraud. Also, there are enough other NiH results which suggest a LENR reaction.
““You can’t deliver one megawatt of steam through a 2½-inch pipe unless you go hypersonic,” the expert said. So observers of the big 1 megawatt demonstration that Rossi promised for October should look for steam exiting the shipping container in excess of 768 mph.”
Sometimes a person loses the forest by concentrating on the trees. Such a noteworthy discrepancy will shake the faith of some believers, but the evidence of Rossi’s legitimacy is too strong, based upon previous demonstrations.
Looking forward to news of the latest demonstration in Italy today, although I doubt it will satisfy Rossi’s detractors.
You will not go supersonic in the tube. You can deliver the steam through a 2.5 inch line if you would wish, but when the speed in the line will get near to sonic the pressure in the line will increase (and hence the condensation temperature) just so that the speed is sonic. To model in detail what would happen to the steam over the length of the line is a nice calculation exercise whereby you split up the length in sections and then you assume that the expansion per section is isentropic (no exchange of heat to environment). At the outlet(if there is no diffusor), the velocity also will be sonic, but the steam density (and the pressure at the outlet) will be higher just to meet the total mass flow.
I don’t think Rossi has developed a repeatable process, but I go along with the theory that he created large amounts of heat to begin with but could not get stability until he reduced the input power so much that he wasn’t getting any excess heat anymore and his poor calorimetry means he might not have realised it yet (or is trying to carry on and covering up because he still believes he will get stable excess heat very soon).
I’m not so sure that not seeing positive results is the same as the device has been proven not to work. Surely, if you subscribe to the idea that Piantelli observed excess heat there should be a probabilty that this device (with the correct variables) could generate excess heat even without the “mystery” catalyser.
The good news is that he has a self imposed deadline so at least when this runs on more and more investors will be able to question the October claim.
There is just over 2500kJ/kg energy required to take 20°C water and turn it into 100°C steam, so 1MW needs 0.4kg/s steam flow. 1bar (atmospheric pressure) 100°C steam is 1.7m³/kg, so 0.4kg/s is 0.7m³/s. Ø60mm ID pipe has area of 0.0028m², so flow velocity would need to be 0.7/0.0028=250m/s.
250m/s is a long way below the speed of sound for steam and velocity would decrease roughly inversely proportionally to pressure as well (ie double steam pressure = half velocity).
A 2.5 inch pipe is quite capable of delivering 1MW of steam heat if the steam pressure is 2-3 bar absolute.
You’ve got the density of steam wrong. It’s (1/1.7) m^3/kg, which gives 400 m/s speed, which is over the speed of sound.
Higher pressure inside the pipe doesn’t appreciably change the velocity of the steam when it reaches the exit, where the pressure is 1 atm; i.e. it will expand rapidly at the exit to give something close to the calculated speed. So it should be supersonic.
Sorry, your density was right. So the speed is only 2/3 the speed of sound.
But my second paragraph stands.
Lewan is there, anyway.
I wouldn’t bet on “just 26 days left to play out.” Unforeseen difficulties” for any number of perfectly plausible reasons — Rossi’s followers won’t just give it all up.
Well, NASA Won’t Deny neither the Relationship With Rossi as well. The NASA replies are very illustrative:
- “We can’t discuss anything about that,” Bushnell said.
- “You know I can’t answer that,” Dunn wrote. “All I can say is that I was ‘out of the country.’ The rest is up to your imagination.”
Why not to say clear without mooting the point; apparently, there is some legal limitation like NDA, it implies some pretty specific and well documented relation.
Steam [...] in excess of 768 mph??
Rossi has said there is an integrated heat exchanger in each of the 52 modules. So there should be only “hot water”…